Series 1 - Episode 8

PookasRule
Dungeoneer
Dungeoneer
Posts: 48
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 7:58 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Re:Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by PookasRule » Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:27 am

A most interesting discussion. Series 1, while basic compared to the later series, was nonetheless a great introduction to the show. I love how the episode and the series ended in mystery - just what would the team have encountered had they been able to bring down the Walls of Jericho? Indeed, what would have happened had the team taken the horn - would their quest still have ended prematurely?

I reckon the team were near the end anyway - perhaps a visit to the Medusa room where the SHIELD spell would have saved them and then a final encounter with Mogdred - whether they would have defeated him or not is impossible to say - casting the spell OPPOSITE would probably take too long and as evidenced in Series 4 Episode 1 Mogdred wastes no time in killing dungeoneers.

I too am of the opinion that Mogdred was definitely supposed to make an appearance in Series 1 (why should Merlin mention him if he was never intended to appear?) - but we shall never know if John Woodnutt actually filmed an encounter with a dungeoneer in his guise of Mogdred. His name appears in the end credits but this could well have been an oversight. A similar mistake happened in Series 4 - John Woodnutt is only credited as Merlin in the episode where Mogdred kills his first dungeoneer face to face!
I'm a Mogdred fan!

User avatar
Eyeshield
Inoperative
Posts: 497
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 10:55 am
Location: Harpenden

Re:Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by Eyeshield » Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:59 am

The trouble with the cast lists in Series 1 and 2 is that each was obviously written ages before the series was completed, and not revised as necessary.

The Series 1 cast, if it had been revised after filming was completed, could have added Gibbet to Alec Westwood, Giant to Edmund Dehn, removed Mogdred from John Woodnutt, and changed "Knight" to "Gumboil". (Although there is an issue here about filming not being completed before the first episode went out, I believe.)

Similarly, with Series 2, Igneous needed to be added to Edmund Dehn, "Monk" could have been changed to "Cedric", and they could even have added Oracle of Confusion to Audrey Jenkinson. Perhaps this is why they hedged their bets in Series 4, just writing a list of "The Players", which was never very helpful for working out who played the door monsters!
This account is disabled.
My new account is TheOldenDays

Helvellyn
Dungeoneer
Dungeoneer
Posts: 34
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 6:31 pm

Re:Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by Helvellyn » Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:19 pm

Eyeshield wrote: Perhaps this is why they hedged their bets in Series 4, just writing a list of "The Players", which was never very helpful for working out who played the door monsters!
Much to the relief of the actors concerned, no doubt. The door monsters really were a low point in Knightmare for me.

knightmaredave
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2002 4:31 pm
Location: manchester

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by knightmaredave » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:05 pm

my favourite epsiode was episode 8 it was ashort but exciting intro to level 3 i agree with the opposite it could have been used but a sthe dungeion was ending it was an excuse to end gameplay. I thinkn that they saw the cuo and thought holy grail but nilrem could have ended upo in mogdres lAIR maybe?? you can never know with level 3 ha ha ha an excellent epiosde tho

Kieran
Fright Knight
Fright Knight
Posts: 1028
Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2002 2:54 am
Location: Blackpool
Contact:

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by Kieran » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:59 pm

The actors credits situaiton is a very interesting one. As explained above the credits for S1/2 rarely reflect what actually happened in the said episode.

The fact that Mogdred didn't manage to appear in S1 is another strange one. Clearly the character had been drawn up and created (hence Merlin's mentioning of him), and indeed made it into the credits. Time must have been against them, perhaps. Mayhaps not enough quests made it to Level 3, or he has a specific room he was due to appear in, yet the dungeoneer never made it?

Either way, the haunting music at the entrance of level 3 give it a nice atmosphere here.

Drassil
Senior Staff
Senior Staff
Posts: 2077
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:01 pm
Contact:

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by Drassil » Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:03 pm

What was this Level 2 all about? A performance in the Hall of Spears that should have left Richard more swiss-cheesed than Sam Beckett on a bad day; a debate over whether to take the bell that was rendered pointless by the fact that it wasn't used; help from Casper at every opportunity; a scene with Merlin rendered pointless by the fact that the spell he gave out was never used (or seen to be used). Frustrating stuff. All we as watchers can really do is be grateful that the production team arranged for us to get a look at Level 3.

If Level 2 did have a missing scene, I suspect that it would have involved Gumboil rather than Mogdred.
Tom41 wrote:If you look carefully, you can see him step down from the step after collecting the clue objects.
I found this extremely entertaining.
Tom41 wrote: First team to get to Level 3!
Unless Gibbet tried to dispose of Simon down the wellway...
Tom41 wrote: Entered a room full of skulls, and a giant skeleton appeared! Same music used here as for Team 1's death sequence...
I liked this touch. It brought us full circle from the first episode to the last.

Here, from the Remixed Knightmare thread, is how the episode could have ended:
I wrote: [Series 1. Richard is at Jericho 6, holding up the dagger.]

Treguard: Why are you carrying a weapon of so little use to one who's blindfold? Where is the horn to bring down the walls of Jericho?

[Richard puts the hilt of the dagger to his mouth and makes tooting noises.]

Treguard: That will not work, team.

Richard: Wait! I know!

[Richard breaks one of the horns off the Helmet of Justice and blows into it. The solo from the song Baker Street is heard. The bricks disappear. Behind the wall is standing...]

Bob Holness: Well done, Richard. You've busted the blocks. And you play that almost as well as I do. I must go now, but to find me again, just look for my first name spelt backwards over a portal.

Treguard: [Muttering] Just one more year and then I'll be happy.
The end credits laughter for this episode would have been a great final opportunity to introduce Mogdred and whet viewers' appetites for the hoped-for next series.

User avatar
wombstar
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Posts: 490
Joined: Sun May 12, 2013 9:25 pm

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by wombstar » Sat Jun 29, 2013 3:09 pm

It was important the team didn't die, there wasn't enough time to start a new quest, not needing an object on level 2 means they couldn't pick up the wrong one. It's possible the spell 'Shield' used and then edited out of the episode because they had too much footage.

And stopping those spikes mid way was a really poor idea.
why bother trying to avoid them if they just pause once you step in front of them? Sure remove them once the team passes like other quests.

Caper locked door wasn't much of a challenge like other quests.

The M letter puzzle was a nice variation.

And while we had a first look at level 3 it didn't come across as challenging at all.. easier than level one!!! the team were told they were almost done.

I wonder if the episode to set up to allow enough time for a win, hence an easy ride but also designed to kill the team off at the end if they ran out of time.. the team were quite slow with the M and in the clue rooms.
It's always the cracked ones that let the light in

User avatar
HobGoblin
Staff
Staff
Posts: 380
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:20 pm

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by HobGoblin » Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:00 pm

Useless level 2 objects seem to be a recurring theme in S1.

The Shield spell does suggest medusa was primed and ready to go but wasn't used/reached. Does anyone know when S2 was commissioned? Did the producers know at this point they could hold some great stuff back?

Given the obvious manipulation of this quest I'm not sure how much kudos can go to the final team for being series 'champions'!

And though most of the characters in KM still look great today, those cavernwights have dated badly - those mops on their heads! On that note, it seemed so easy to zoom past them I don't think it would have occurred to me to fanny about with the bottle of scent, despite Treguard's subtle clue.

Ah, S2 next, which contains so many wonderful, vivid childhood memories that I'll probably break down and cry at regular intervals ;D
Extreme warning team, a Hobgoblin in the level!

User avatar
wombstar
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Posts: 490
Joined: Sun May 12, 2013 9:25 pm

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by wombstar » Sat Jun 29, 2013 6:02 pm

cavernwights still looked great.
It's always the cracked ones that let the light in

pjmlfc05
Knight
Knight
Posts: 591
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 7:58 pm
Location: Hampshire

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by pjmlfc05 » Sat Jun 29, 2013 6:13 pm

I think with series 1 because it was new, there was always going to be teething problems. The last episode I thought was ok but the team should of realised not to take the dagger. Series 2 is a huge improvement and I can't wait to see it!
The only way is onward, there is no turning back.

Canadanne
Fright Knight
Fright Knight
Posts: 1866
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:53 pm
Location: Poole, Dorset
Contact:

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by Canadanne » Sat Jun 29, 2013 6:52 pm

Drassil wrote:a debate over whether to take the bell that was rendered pointless by the fact that it wasn't used;
Yeah, and right after Treguard made a big speech about how every decision was critical from this point on! I too think they were probably supposed to take the gold for a Gumboil scene like we see in Series 2.

I cannot take the cavernwights seriously at all, they just look like elderly wombles! Was amused to see a number of people on Twitter make the same comment last night.

fluttermoth
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Level 1 Dungeoneer
Posts: 69
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:24 pm

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by fluttermoth » Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:52 am

My son and I have always thought that the cavernwights looked like evil Clangers ;D

knightmaredave
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Level 3 Dungeoneer
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2002 4:31 pm
Location: manchester

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by knightmaredave » Sat Nov 23, 2013 1:37 pm

I'm having a series 1 morning whilst school working.
Do you think that as Tim knew series close was near they put a horn and a dagger in the hope they would take the dagger so he could kill them off? I mean a horn can be dangerous as a dagger too.
I would have liked o have seen Mogdred behind the jericho wall and not merlin!

User avatar
Gretel
Level 2 Dungeoneer
Level 2 Dungeoneer
Posts: 111
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2014 10:55 pm
Location: Essex, UK

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by Gretel » Fri May 16, 2014 12:46 am

Am I wrong or is this the last time a final team doesn't wind up dead due to time running out?
"you should be able to hear from my voice that I'm terribly pretty, now DO you think I'm pretty?"

Canadanne
Fright Knight
Fright Knight
Posts: 1866
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:53 pm
Location: Poole, Dorset
Contact:

Re: Series 1 - Episode 8

Post by Canadanne » Thu Mar 19, 2015 11:23 pm

Eyeshield wrote:This is what should have happened in level three:

Richard takes horn from the clue room, quest progresses to the Wall of Jericho as per what actually happened, Richard blows horn to get rid of wall (exactly the same as Chris in the next series), Merlin's room is revealed beyond, Mogdred appears and gloats/threatens/starts trying to kill dungeoneer, advisor (Edward) casts OPPOSITE, Mogdred turns into Merlin, Merlin tells team they've won, Treguard gives team silver spurs and congrats and then says goodbye to watchers, episode ends.

That's what I think, anyway. ;D
Kieran wrote:The fact that Mogdred didn't manage to appear in S1 is another strange one. Clearly the character had been drawn up and created (hence Merlin's mentioning of him), and indeed made it into the credits. Time must have been against them, perhaps. Mayhaps not enough quests made it to Level 3, or he has a specific room he was due to appear in, yet the dungeoneer never made it?
Piecing together the various plans and briefs in David Rowe's book, we may now have some idea as to how Richard's quest would have played out. It seems that Kieran was right: the room behind the Jericho wall is referred to as 'Mogdred's chamber' (or Mordred's, as they apparently called him at first - I guess Spoony wasn't so wrong about that!), and it would have contained an 'M' device like those used to summon Merlin. The name of the room presumably implies that Mogdred would have been summoned instead, perhaps lending support to the theory that the OPPOSITE spell would be needed to transform him into Merlin. That's not quite the end of the quest, though - the final conflict would then have been with the dragon, probably defeating it with a spell from Merlin. Finally Richard would have emerged in the Valley, labelled on the diagram as "FREE!" (Note that the Series 1 quests didn't involve collecting and reassembling any specific quest item.)
Porsmond wrote:Level 3 First Room - The First view of Level 3 for the viewers, nice looking room and and the music was very cool indeed, Loved the Skeleton appearing too, however it looked like the team was never in danger, he stayed still.
I'm not so sure about the lack of danger, as the first two rooms of Level 3 both have 'DEAD' options attached on the diagram! Perhaps they would have died if they tried to walk through the skeleton that was blocking the right-hand door?
DragonRider wrote:I imagine if they walked through the Nilrem door they would of got Merlin berating them for going the wrong way!
The brief for the clue room says "NILREM door choice triggers wipe-out", which seems to imply that instant death would occur if they chose that exit instead of the one marked with the Cup.
Tom41 wrote:Used the SNIFF bottle to 'blind' the sense of smell of the Cavernwites.
Nice detail in the book about the SNIFF bottle containing real perfume. :)
Porsmond wrote:Merlin Room - He gave them a SHIELD spell but again what on earth was that meant to be used for I wonder???Maybe it was a protection spell from the Medusa room if it appeared in Series 1 to get past???
The Medusa room is indeed included on the quest diagram (after the Gargoyle and before the Jericho wall), and was surely what the SHIELD spell was needed for, but it wasn't shown as they obviously ran out of time. I wonder if that scene was filmed or not?

Post Reply