The new KM episode is up!

Discussion about Knightmare in youtube's Geek Week.
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wombstar
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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by wombstar » Tue Aug 13, 2013 8:44 pm

Do you mean more was filmed before the team died and cut out? Or they filmed more afterwards?
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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by Mystara » Tue Aug 13, 2013 8:59 pm

Both
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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by UnclePob » Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:41 pm

Mystara wrote:
wombstar wrote:Do you mean more was filmed before the team died and cut out? Or they filmed more afterwards?
Both
I'm aware that Tim Child recently informed us that we'd eventually get a more extensive video containing the content that was cut from the episode. I wonder if this was always the plan, or whether the chopped material was simply such high quality that Tim decided it was too good to remain forever unseen?

If the extended video idea was decided beforehand, it would make sense - while everyone is present and the Norwich studios available - to have filmed more material than was necessary, deliberately. There will have been certain limits and restrictions posed by Google in regard to the actual episode itself, and the whole process will have meant Tim won't have had quite the same level of control over the resulting episode as he would have had with an independently created pilot. Time was certainly an issue.

I've no idea what this additional footage is, though I'm sure much of the footage we're yet to see was fully intended to be used in the episode. If certain reports are to be believed, the plan was to have the episode conclude with a stalemate, but when the team accidentally killed their dungeoneer there was an opportunity to have a dramatic ending, which was seized on at the last minute at the cost of a few earlier rooms which were cut for time.

That being the case, much of the unseen footage isn't suspicious in the least and was merely chopped out to keep to time. It's the extra footage that makes me wonder... perhaps Tim might be planning to release a Director's Cut version of the episode, with all the missing rooms and a couple of extras slotted in there to increase the length. Certainly 45-minute to 1-hour episodes are more appropriate in this day and age to the 30-minute (well, 20) episodes of old, and if everything's polished to a gleam, missing elements are added in, and the whole thing is book-ended with new opening and closing sequences - this new version could be a deliberate, and possibly brilliant pilot, where the Geek Week episode in and of itself wouldn't really have been appropriate :)

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by fluttermoth » Tue Aug 13, 2013 10:29 pm

Fantastic; roll on the 'Director's Cut' ;)

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by pjmlfc05 » Wed Aug 14, 2013 8:47 am

UnclePob wrote:
Mystara wrote:
wombstar wrote:Do you mean more was filmed before the team died and cut out? Or they filmed more afterwards?
Both
I'm aware that Tim Child recently informed us that we'd eventually get a more extensive video containing the content that was cut from the episode. I wonder if this was always the plan, or whether the chopped material was simply such high quality that Tim decided it was too good to remain forever unseen?

If the extended video idea was decided beforehand, it would make sense - while everyone is present and the Norwich studios available - to have filmed more material than was necessary, deliberately. There will have been certain limits and restrictions posed by Google in regard to the actual episode itself, and the whole process will have meant Tim won't have had quite the same level of control over the resulting episode as he would have had with an independently created pilot. Time was certainly an issue.

I've no idea what this additional footage is, though I'm sure much of the footage we're yet to see was fully intended to be used in the episode. If certain reports are to be believed, the plan was to have the episode conclude with a stalemate, but when the team accidentally killed their dungeoneer there was an opportunity to have a dramatic ending, which was seized on at the last minute at the cost of a few earlier rooms which were cut for time.

That being the case, much of the unseen footage isn't suspicious in the least and was merely chopped out to keep to time. It's the extra footage that makes me wonder... perhaps Tim might be planning to release a Director's Cut version of the episode, with all the missing rooms and a couple of extras slotted in there to increase the length. Certainly 45-minute to 1-hour episodes are more appropriate in this day and age to the 30-minute (well, 20) episodes of old, and if everything's polished to a gleam, missing elements are added in, and the whole thing is book-ended with new opening and closing sequences - this new version could be a deliberate, and possibly brilliant pilot, where the Geek Week episode in and of itself wouldn't really have been appropriate :)
It's most likely to be a directors cut I'm guessing. But I like your way of thinking!
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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by beveryafraid » Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:25 am

It’s not a director’s cut. Much simpler explanation.

Google YouTube didn’t want anything longer than 25 minutes. That was quite hard (well very actually) to do without the sort of butchery which would have made a complete nonsense of the sub plots and storylines. As it is they took a bit of savaging and quite a lot of excellent team interaction had to be lost together with three more dungeon chambers, and quite a bit of Lord Fear, Lissard and Theodora Snitch delivering game information which related to parts of the game we were no longer able to see.
The main purpose of the re cut is to produce an effective selling pilot for a new broadcast vehicle

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by Gundrada » Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:36 am

beveryafraid wrote:It’s not a director’s cut. Much simpler explanation.

Google YouTube didn’t want anything longer than 25 minutes. That was quite hard (well very actually) to do without the sort of butchery which would have made a complete nonsense of the sub plots and storylines. As it is they took a bit of savaging and quite a lot of excellent team interaction had to be lost together with three more dungeon chambers, and quite a bit of Lord Fear, Lissard and Theodora Snitch delivering game information which related to parts of the game we were no longer able to see.
The main purpose of the re cut is to produce an effective selling pilot for a new broadcast vehicle
See, now I would have LOVED to have seen this *gets all exciticled*

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by UnclePob » Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:01 am

beveryafraid wrote:It’s not a director’s cut. Much simpler explanation.

Google YouTube didn’t want anything longer than 25 minutes. That was quite hard (well very actually) to do without the sort of butchery which would have made a complete nonsense of the sub plots and storylines. As it is they took a bit of savaging and quite a lot of excellent team interaction had to be lost together with three more dungeon chambers, and quite a bit of Lord Fear, Lissard and Theodora Snitch delivering game information which related to parts of the game we were no longer able to see.
Thanks for clarifying this. To be honest I figured most of this out already since it was clear that this sort of venture, contracted by a company like Google, and coupled with the unpredictability of genuine gameplay was always going to cause the episode to over-run and require editing for time. That hasn't impacted my desire to see the cut material in the least, and I look forward to seeing these cut rooms and puzzles at some point in whatever form they are presented to us.
beveryafraid wrote:The main purpose of the re cut is to produce an effective selling pilot for a new broadcast vehicle
I can't believe, that just for once in my life I've actually over-thought a situation and seem to have gotten it right, concerning the proper pilot :)

That's absolutely amazing to hear, Tim! While we were all simply crossing our fingers and hoping that the new episode simply serves as a pilot through sheer popularity alone, the opportunity was definitely there to use the available facilities to shoot material with which you're able to have much more control over - meaning a much more effective actual pilot for Knightmare!

I can't even begin to express how thankful I am to hear that :D

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by fluttermoth » Wed Aug 14, 2013 1:17 pm

beveryafraid wrote:It’s not a director’s cut. Much simpler explanation.
The main purpose of the re cut is to produce an effective selling pilot for a new broadcast vehicle
I actually got my son in to look at that, just to make sure I wasn't misreading it in a mad rush of over-optimism!

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by UnclePob » Wed Aug 14, 2013 1:36 pm

fluttermoth wrote:
beveryafraid wrote:It’s not a director’s cut. Much simpler explanation.
The main purpose of the re cut is to produce an effective selling pilot for a new broadcast vehicle
I actually got my son in to look at that, just to make sure I wasn't misreading it in a mad rush of over-optimism!
It took me a couple of reads as well. I've grown so accustomed to seeing things that aren't there when I really really want them to be there, especially with things that are almost too good to be true. This doesn't appear to be the case here.

Tim very specifically said "recut", so he's referring to the updated version with changes and additional footage included that will eventually be released, rather than the Geek Week special itself. Knightmare is definitely stirring, and while a new pilot makes no promises that a full series will result, I have an especially good feeling about this one :)

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by Peter » Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:02 pm

I honestly cannot wait for that, thank you so much Tim.

Apologies for my ignorance if this has already been explained, but was there any reasons offered for the sound effects revap, ie. Door entering, goblin horn, spell casting, opening theme, life force, atmospheric background ensembles?

Was it budget issues, copyright issues, creative decision/new direction? :)

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by Dessimat0r » Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:22 pm

The additional stuff shot after the dungeoneer's death is likely to be future rooms (unexplored), and scenes from Lord Fear through the spyglass :) That's just my guess. 8)

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by pjmlfc05 » Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:37 pm

I pretty much echo the last couple of comments and just to say thank you Tim. :)
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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by fluttermoth » Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:42 pm

Yes, thank you, Tim; we're very lucky that you take the time to come and post here; it's very good of you and much appreciated :D

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Re: The new KM episode is up!

Post by UnclePob » Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:47 pm

Peter wrote:I honestly cannot wait for that, thank you so much Tim.

Apologies for my ignorance if this has already been explained, but was there any reasons offered for the sound effects revap, ie. Door entering, goblin horn, spell casting, opening theme, life force, atmospheric background ensembles?

Was it budget issues, copyright issues, creative decision/new direction? :)
I've not heard any explanation for why these changes were made. Perhaps Alan or Tim might step in and clarify exactly what was going on there.

I doubt it was for copyright reasons though the possibility does exist. I was personally surprised to find the original opening theme was used, since it definitely had certain rights issues around the time KMVR was made (hence it couldn't be used at the time). Would a potential future series still be able to use the theme, have the rights issues been fully resolved?

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