Knightmare Convention

Discussion and posts relating to the 2014 Knightmare Convention in Norwich
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Mystara
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Mystara » Thu Mar 20, 2014 6:46 pm

wombstar wrote:I've been posting links and trying to get word out as much as I can I have very little friends on social web sites, and I'm not very active online but I've brought it up on my local hangouts, The thing is I get the same response form everybody "oh I love km, been watching the repeats.. love a new series..." but nobody seems to be interested in a convention, it's hard to convert fans into cash.
I'm utterly confused by that kind of statement - "not interested in a convention"
What is it about the word "convention" that makes them not want to go? What is it that they envision that makes it so unbearable to an alleged fan of the show?

Surely the idea of getting to PLAY Knightmare should be worth the money on its own? Surely even if everything else convention related were so abhorrent to them, they could still manage to come in, queue up, play the dungeon, and leave again?

Have they been to conventions before? Do they know what's at the Knightmare convention? If we had called it "Knightmare studio tour" or "Knightmare mooglewobblefluffbandit" would they suddenly be interested?

And even then, what's their excuse for not buying a tshirt, a programme, or even the DVD if they're fans of the show? Heck, there's even a £1 digital desktop pattern/wallpaper available now!

As I say, I really just don't understand that statement. My best interpretation is that what they mean is "Yeah, I like Knightmare, but I'm not really all that into it that I'd be willing to pay £15 to play it".
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Mystara » Thu Mar 20, 2014 7:07 pm

pjmlfc05 wrote: I know the feeling. The response I've had from friends back in Liverpool is that they would love to go but they are too far away to attend. So therefore they find it hard to justify making a pledge if they can't attend.
Now THAT argument I can at least understand.
But then that's why we made DVDs, tshirts, programmes and now a wallpaper available.

Surely even as Knightmare fans, the argument "A £1 purchase of a digital wallpaper means you significantly increase the chances of Knightmare returning" should go a long way to getting something out of them, no?
Again I share your frustration but I do disagree with the "will not" than "cannot" bit. I'm sure there are people who would love to make a pledge but due to their financial circumstances, cannot do so. I am one of those people. I think also people on here would love to see this happen and have yet to see people say so otherwise.
Again, personally, I can understand that (although I don't see £1 being beyond the means of anyone here).

But it's not just on the financial side, it's also on the social side. I can do a complete search on Twitter for the word "Knightmare". I see numerous posts from HStorm. I see lots from dungeoneerborne. I see a goodly number from Knightmare Live, Mark Knight, Epic Studios and others. They're all posting repeatedly, every day.

But the number of people doing that can be counted on both my hands. From other people, I see nothing at all. It seems people are either working their asses off trying to get the word out or else doing absolutely nothing.

Is this really the peak workload of the Knightmare community? Is this really all we can manage? If, for example, Tim Child stepped in right now and said that he will not produce a new series of Knightmare unless the convention goes ahead, would we really be unable to accomplish anything more?
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by wombstar » Thu Mar 20, 2014 9:05 pm

What is it about the word "convention" that makes them not want to go?
Because not everyone gets into 'geek culture' which is what conventions are associated with, it's not the sort of thing that attracts 'causal fans'
The response I've had from friends back in Liverpool is that they would love to go but they are too far away to attend.
And while it's pointed out you can buy dvds and t-shirts instead I find people tend to buy souvenirs if they've attended something like this, not instead of.
but I do disagree with the "will not" than "cannot" bit.
I was going to make a similar point. (maybe they pledged for the David's book instead as I did) but those people seem to be getting a lot of grief, they just have different priorities (work, family, bills, in which case every penny counts)

******
Dose the Km convention offer photo shoots? Might be another way to draw in more money, I see this a lot with celebs at conventions.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Mystara » Thu Mar 20, 2014 10:13 pm

wombstar wrote:
What is it about the word "convention" that makes them not want to go?
Because not everyone gets into 'geek culture' which is what conventions are associated with, it's not the sort of thing that attracts 'causal fans'
Ah, well then - don't call it a convention when you mention it to your friends. Call it a "studio tour". Problem solved!

Really, the word "convention" was absolutely, entirely arbitrary. It very nearly got called "reuknightmare".
And while it's pointed out you can buy dvds and t-shirts instead I find people tend to buy souvenirs if they've attended something like this, not instead of.
But what people "tend to do" is irrelevant in this scenario. You've said that you/these people would love to contribute, but they live far away.
Well, that's why we created the DVD perk - so that you can contribute without having to travel to the event.

Again, problem solved.

What they "usually do" doesn't apply in this situation because they want to contribute, remember?
I was going to make a similar point. (maybe they pledged for the David's book instead as I did) but those people seem to be getting a lot of grief, they just have different priorities (work, family, bills, in which case every penny counts)
Hm, curiously, I don't see your name in the list of pledgers for David Rowe's campaign. You might want to look into that.
Dose the Km convention offer photo shoots? Might be another way to draw in more money, I see this a lot with celebs at conventions.
Yes it does.
But no, it won't make us any money at this stage, if ever.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by wombstar » Fri Mar 21, 2014 2:21 am

Mystara wrote: Hm, curiously, I don't see your name in the list of pledgers for David Rowe's campaign. You might want to look into that.
What do you mean?
All paid and all items received other than the book, so I must be on his list.

HStorm wrote:11:20am until about 12:40pm on Saturday please?
I'll be at work sadly.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Mystara » Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:58 am

Current stats are that 1% of people that visit the campaign page pledge.
Quite possibly people are not expecting to be greeted by an IGG page. But that's a crap excuse for not pledging.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Mystara » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:36 am

I am trying to be very careful in responding to these posts because I don't want Knightmare to die and the last thing I want is a programme commissioner to come across a list of reasons not to commission Knightmare.

On the other hand, it is essential that you stop living in denial and realise the success of the show (a totally random event notwithstanding) is down to you.

There is no formal link between the success of the convention and Knightmare. Despite my earlier example, T has not threatened to never make Knightmare unless the convention goes ahead.

But if you think about it logically, this is a much more accurate test of how successful a commissioning would be. The number of geek week views is meaningless. If it weren't, Tv channels would be buying up videos of sneezing kittens, talking dogs and drunk children. A programme commissioner wants a cheap, safe show that he knows people will watch. Knightmare is old, if it comes back it will have to change. Therefore, the test is how committed the fan base are. Are they fans who will leave if their show is changed? If so, they're worthless because the show will have to change.

The Geek Week episode feedback from the community suggests we are intolerant to change. If the convention and DVD campaigns fail, it suggests not enough of us are committed. The end result? Knightmare is better confined to the vaults of nostalgia.

If that upsets or depresses you then it's simply because you are now realising that our position is not as strong as you thought it was. The fact is that if we had a big fanbase that would definitely support a new Knightmare then funding this convention would be child's play.
If we can't, it means the fan base is not committed and so a new KM is a risk.

And commissioners don't take risks, as noted by John Cleese et al recently.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by malibupete » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:49 am

My apologies, Alan - after Mark made it explicit in his video yesterday, and given previous hints you made on the subject, I assumed there was a direct link.

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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Mystara » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:57 am

Mark is probably more in the know than I am, particularly given his work in TV.

He knows more about how the industry works and can probably speak with more authority.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Drassil » Fri Mar 21, 2014 5:05 pm

pjmlfc05 wrote:
Drassil wrote:
Mystara wrote:Today, a friend of mine (who works in the media) remarked: "I cannot believe that so many Knightmare fans cannot raise such a tiny amount of money".
It's more "will not" than "cannot". It's depressing to contemplate. Some of the biggest Knightmare fans I know are seemingly showing the least support, and if any of them says anything resembling "I didn't think it would succeed" in the future then I will struggle not to get angry.
Again I share your frustration but I do disagree with the "will not" than "cannot" bit. I'm sure there are people who would love to make a pledge but due to their financial circumstances, cannot do so. I am one of those people.
On this occasion, you've quoted me accurately but may have misinterpreted what I wrote. :) I sympathise with those who cannot offer monetary support to the campaign because they simply are not able to budget for this kind of thing. The overwhelming problem as I see it is the will-nots: all those fans who could contribute but are choosing not to. That is the point I was making in my earlier post.
pjmlfc05 wrote:I think also people on here would never say that they didn't think it would succeed. Why would they think that for?
I wasn't thinking of any of the current forum regulars (not that there are many) when I made that remark. Whether some of those I did have in mind are looking on and saying to themselves, "It'll happen without my support", telling themselves that "it'll never happen even with my support" or not looking on at all, I honestly don't know.

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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by wombstar » Fri Mar 21, 2014 8:51 pm

malibupete wrote:Sad as it is, conventions will always be viewed by the public as a niche affair for the most obsessive of fans only. There's no easy way around this.
Very much the point I was trying to make, Km does however have a lot of 'causal fans' as I call them.

I'm a bit uncomfortable with the attitude of some regarding those who can not/haven't pledged,
dugeoneerborne wrote:I'm almost starting to loathe some of the km fanbase
if this is kind of animosity in the community no wonder people are put off.
HStorm wrote:A message from Lord Fear for anyone who can't be there at the appropriate hour; you can still help
Excellent, never knew about theses.. i'll shall try and set something up.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by Mystara » Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:10 pm

wombstar wrote:
malibupete wrote:Sad as it is, conventions will always be viewed by the public as a niche affair for the most obsessive of fans only. There's no easy way around this.
Very much the point I was trying to make, Km does however have a lot of 'causal fans' as I call them.
Well then, as I said, stop calling it a convention and call it a "studio tour" or a "meet up". If it's the word "convention" that's upsetting people, rather than the actual content, then stop calling it a convention.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by dugeoneerborne » Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:34 pm

Wombstar: I'm sorry I'm not trying to put anyone off I was pretty frustrated when I typed that at the time ( i guess My own bitterness from My own fb campaign for something else of recent has brought these feelings up), I want this to happen as much as everyone else & sometimes I don't think before I type stuff up so I apologise again to anyone in full.
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by HobGoblin » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:54 pm

Let's not get too downhearted. If this doesn't happen, yes it will be extremely disappointing and a big missed opportunity but we'll still always have Knightmare. If we don't get the chance to celebrate the show all together in Norwich then we'll just have to continue doing it in our own way, be it through great little pieces of fan art or silly articles about Knightmare jumping the shark or whatever. :)

In the meantime, let's all keep our chins up - there's still time and I'm sure lots of people are intending to pledge but just haven't been able to do so yet.

Have a great weekend everyone!
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Re: Knightmare Convention

Post by HobGoblin » Sat Mar 22, 2014 2:26 pm

I remain hopeful there'll be a last minute rush. If a few big spenders also get involved who knows what might happen.

If I was rich and wanted to fund the whole thing (let me make absolutely clear this is not the case) I think I'd wait until the last possible minute for dramatic effect. Just a thought! ;D

Anyway, I'm still traveling hopefully...
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