A good Vs Evil topic

[Purgatory]

A Mogdred/Lord fear topic.
Anyway not sure what I'm trying to do with this post i guess looking for your comments on the Mogdred Lord fear relationship or connection.. if there is one,

So was Lord Fear still running the dungeon over the 1st 4 seasons? No spy glass to see what his up to, and even his 1st appearance in season 5 he still didn't appear in the game itself..

Another thing i thought was very interesting, Mogdred doing the whole 'hand' thing in season 2.. (sounds like Lord fear has been teached by the master?)

Mogdred also having alot more action in level 2 i thought was very odd, We never got to see im in the 'flesh' all that much but he did make his presence felt a number of times which made him far more 'fighting' We do tend to see alot of Lord fear but he doesn't really put much fear into the team,
Mogdred speeches were far more effective that Lord fears hand. (not knocking the whle hand stuff)

Mogdred was also knowing to try to disguise him self on a number of times...( as a monk?) which reminded me of the whole debate we had in another post about was it Hordiss or lord fear ( you know the one) So if Lord fear does indeed take after Mogdred then it's very possible we should have seen him in disguise,
Has anyone took a look what the ring looks like on Mogdreds hand? does it look anything like the ones Lord fear has?? this could be a clue to a Mogdred/fear connection. Not sure why Mogdred would need to require and assistance to guard the 3rd levels in seasons 3 and 4 i'm guess a double loss on the 2nd was just to much for him.
And we can't for get that Mordred's goblins are indeed the same as Fears, Tiny was seen in season 3.. or do all Goblins look the same???

So did Mordred step down after season 4 or did Lord fear defeat him? Looking at this with Mogdread being the 'boss' of the dungeon, did make an appearance in the 1st season but Merlin say he had to be defeated..

Hummmm :-\ The only thing thay really keeps early knightmare and the 2nd stage together is in fact Treguard and maybe the original Helmet. id like to think there so something in the same vain for the oppision,

Only thing that comes to mind is, it was once
Mogdred Vs Merlin, and now it's Treguard Vs Lord Fear,
It was after all Merlin who wanted to stop Lord fear not Treguard... Okay that enough rambling, hope it opens the doors for some good old coverstaion

[Willowherb]

Nah, Lord Fear wouldn't have been around in the first four seasons. The early Dungeon was the malevolent force in itself with Treguard setting the challenge and Morghanna and Mogdred setting themselves up as evil powers who chose the Dungeon as a suitable venue for playtime.
The new Dungeon (or expanded Knightmare world) evolved from the old, but was quite different. I always assumed that Mogdred and Morghanna had decided to leave/been ousted by Lord Fear. Since Treguard had started championing the dungeoneers and become chief of The Powers That Be it made sense for the new evil sorcerer-type in town to work directly against him and form a more coherent Opposition than than of yore. (I don't think 'The Powers That Be' or 'Opposition' were even terms that were used in series 1-4).

[Purgatory]

'the Powers That Be' or 'Opposition' was present during them early showings.
Merlin was always a good guy, Folly was always good.. as well as others, no different than today.

Morghanna was only in for one seasons, i guess after Mogdreds poor performance in season 2 (2 winners) she needed to show him how it's done, lol
However Malice confused matters even more. (and then her possible appearance on season

Well it's all about the actors really, Loose one and you lose a couple or characters (Merlin/Mogdred) hard to have any really story when the same actor plays both the good and bad guy lol

[HStorm]

The Powers That Be was a phrase never used until S5. The Opposition was referenced a few times in S4, but it seemed to be a more general term just referring to opponents of any kind that dungeoneers might run into.

There was no clear allegiance as indicated in later years. Yes there were some good guys as well as some bad guys - that's just the way the world works - but there was no definite alignment and little coherent grouping on either side.

Another thing that must be recognised is that Treguard was clearly not a member of the PTB early on. He seemed to enjoy dungeoneers getting into trouble back then, and on more than one occasion he insisted he was strictly a neutral referee of the game. In the opening quest he even said, "Now I can do nothing for you even if I wished it."

[Skarkill]

That is a brillant Quote.

I have that clip on my harddrive and it is appsalutly brill.

Fantastic first ever death.

Followed by

"Oh Dear What A Pitty."

[Purgatory]

I don't think i have ever seen the 1st 2 seasons, so i'm unfamiliar with Treguards attitude toward's the teams.

Thats why i said it's more of a Merlin Vs Mogdred,
Merlin was quite clearly on the good side and in season one did say 'Mogdred must be defeated'
Merlin being the 'good' will play by the rules,
I don't recall Mogdred bending the rules either.. i quess which is why Treguard didn't get to involved.

Um really need to see them episodes, I can't see why Season 2 wont be giving a spin in the future..

[HStorm]

The reason Treguard never interfered when Mogdred was making trouble was that Moggy could freeze him solid just by looking at him!

S2 might be shown by Challenge, but it'll cost more for them to buy that season than the later ones. It was filmed in a much older format, one that can't be used on most modern playback equipment. To use the kind of equipment that can read the film and transfer it to modern VT costs a bomb.

[Moonlight]

The reason Treguard never interfered when Mogdred was making trouble was that Moggy could freeze him solid just by looking at him!

I loved it when that happened... Treguard just sitting there moaning "oooohhhh" at that dippy team who couldn't spell!!!

As for Lord Fear being around to start with and defeating all the others by series 5... I'd be disappointed to think he could defeat Morghanna. I kind of thought she'd just got bored of killing dungeoneers cause it was so easy and gone off somewhere else!

[Purgatory]

oh yeah i forgot tegurad would be frozen..
Lilith was always a big threat, killing a number of teams,

[MoanaLiza]

Like it says in the series 1 guide, Lillith had the power to overpower Treguard! Also as Treguard says; (quote) "Warning team, she commands here, she will not tolerate my presence even as I speak, she rejects me, she rejects me..."

[Wolfshead]

I'll wee if I can shed some light on this.

Treguard is a mortal, he knows a few spells like, DISMISS, HOME, HEROES OR UNITE. He probably go em from Merlin and this is all the magic he can do, which is really no more than a dungeonere except for the fact that he can use his spells more than once.

Undoubtably the Magi of the Dungeon e.g Lillith, Mogred, Lord fear etc posess signficant magical powers includingthe ability to freeze Treguard or to impersinate him in the case of Mildred.

Also I always that that Mogdred was chief of the whole opposition before series 5 rather than just being simply part of it. On Series 4 however Fatilla made references to an "Old Bone Face." Could be Lord Fear, hey maybe its a Catacombite who knows.

Does this help

[Wolfshead]

Was there a power struggle for the dominion of level 3 between Mallice and Mogdred in series 4 or Mogdred and Morghana in series 3?

[HStorm]

There are strong indicators that there may well have been some conflict between Mogdred and Malice in S4, and that Malice may even have won out at first (although she was probably put back in her place when she was defeated by Dicken).

There's no evidence at all of a conflict between Mogdred and Morghanna however.

[Wolfshead]

"Morghana has left the old realm (probably post- Britain) and entered the dungeon vie the lower ctacombs."

"Denizens of the dungeon and catacombs beyond!"

What are these catacombs of which Merlin and Velda spoke?

My personal theory is that the corridor(s) of the tatacombs which are present in levels on and two somehow link the dungeon together as perhaps do the dwarf tunnels?

I do think it possible that Morghana achieved mastery of Level 3, possibly at the expence of Mogdred.

Mogdred must never be confused with Mordred.

[HStorm]

(No one said anything about Mogdred being Mordred.) As I say there is no evidence of any conflict between Mogdred or Morghanna - if Morghanna took over level 3 at Mog's expense, how come Mogdred was present in S4 and Morghanna had disappeared?

Again, it MIGHT have happened, but on what evidence do you base the suggestion?