Series 1 - Episode 8
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The actors credits situaiton is a very interesting one. As explained above the credits for S1/2 rarely reflect what actually happened in the said episode.
The fact that Mogdred didn't manage to appear in S1 is another strange one. Clearly the character had been drawn up and created (hence Merlin's mentioning of him), and indeed made it into the credits. Time must have been against them, perhaps. Mayhaps not enough quests made it to Level 3, or he has a specific room he was due to appear in, yet the dungeoneer never made it?
Either way, the haunting music at the entrance of level 3 give it a nice atmosphere here.
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What was this Level 2 all about? A performance in the Hall of Spears that should have left Richard more swiss-cheesed than Sam Beckett on a bad day; a debate over whether to take the bell that was rendered pointless by the fact that it wasn't used; help from Casper at every opportunity; a scene with Merlin rendered pointless by the fact that the spell he gave out was never used (or seen to be used). Frustrating stuff. All we as watchers can really do is be grateful that the production team arranged for us to get a look at Level 3.
If Level 2 did have a missing scene, I suspect that it would have involved Gumboil rather than Mogdred.
If you look carefully, you can see him step down from the step after collecting the clue objects.
I found this extremely entertaining.
First team to get to Level 3!
Unless Gibbet tried to dispose of Simon down the wellway...
Entered a room full of skulls, and a giant skeleton appeared! Same music used here as for Team 1's death sequence...
I liked this touch. It brought us full circle from the first episode to the last.
Here, from the Remixed Knightmare thread, is how the episode could have ended:
[Series 1. Richard is at Jericho 6, holding up the dagger.]
Treguard: Why are you carrying a weapon of so little use to one who's blindfold? Where is the horn to bring down the walls of Jericho?
[Richard puts the hilt of the dagger to his mouth and makes tooting noises.]
Treguard: That will not work, team.
Richard: Wait! I know!
[Richard breaks one of the horns off the Helmet of Justice and blows into it. The solo from the song Baker Street is heard. The bricks disappear. Behind the wall is standing...]
Bob Holness: Well done, Richard. You've busted the blocks. And you play that almost as well as I do. I must go now, but to find me again, just look for my first name spelt backwards over a portal.
Treguard: [Muttering] Just one more year and then I'll be happy.
The end credits laughter for this episode would have been a great final opportunity to introduce Mogdred and whet viewers' appetites for the hoped-for next series.
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It was important the team didn't die, there wasn't enough time to start a new quest, not needing an object on level 2 means they couldn't pick up the wrong one. It's possible the spell 'Shield' used and then edited out of the episode because they had too much footage.
And stopping those spikes mid way was a really poor idea.
why bother trying to avoid them if they just pause once you step in front of them? Sure remove them once the team passes like other quests.
Caper locked door wasn't much of a challenge like other quests.
The M letter puzzle was a nice variation.
And while we had a first look at level 3 it didn't come across as challenging at all.. easier than level one!!! the team were told they were almost done.
I wonder if the episode to set up to allow enough time for a win, hence an easy ride but also designed to kill the team off at the end if they ran out of time.. the team were quite slow with the M and in the clue rooms.
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Useless level 2 objects seem to be a recurring theme in S1.
The Shield spell does suggest medusa was primed and ready to go but wasn't used/reached. Does anyone know when S2 was commissioned? Did the producers know at this point they could hold some great stuff back?
Given the obvious manipulation of this quest I'm not sure how much kudos can go to the final team for being series 'champions'!
And though most of the characters in KM still look great today, those cavernwights have dated badly - those mops on their heads! On that note, it seemed so easy to zoom past them I don't think it would have occurred to me to fanny about with the bottle of scent, despite Treguard's subtle clue.
Ah, S2 next, which contains so many wonderful, vivid childhood memories that I'll probably break down and cry at regular intervals
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a debate over whether to take the bell that was rendered pointless by the fact that it wasn't used;
Yeah, and right after Treguard made a big speech about how every decision was critical from this point on! I too think they were probably supposed to take the gold for a Gumboil scene like we see in Series 2.
I cannot take the cavernwights seriously at all, they just look like elderly wombles! Was amused to see a number of people on Twitter make the same comment last night.
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My son and I have always thought that the cavernwights looked like evil Clangers
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I'm having a series 1 morning whilst school working.
Do you think that as Tim knew series close was near they put a horn and a dagger in the hope they would take the dagger so he could kill them off? I mean a horn can be dangerous as a dagger too.
I would have liked o have seen Mogdred behind the jericho wall and not merlin!
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This is what should have happened in level three:
Richard takes horn from the clue room, quest progresses to the Wall of Jericho as per what actually happened, Richard blows horn to get rid of wall (exactly the same as Chris in the next series), Merlin's room is revealed beyond, Mogdred appears and gloats/threatens/starts trying to kill dungeoneer, advisor (Edward) casts OPPOSITE, Mogdred turns into Merlin, Merlin tells team they've won, Treguard gives team silver spurs and congrats and then says goodbye to watchers, episode ends.
That's what I think, anyway.
The fact that Mogdred didn't manage to appear in S1 is another strange one. Clearly the character had been drawn up and created (hence Merlin's mentioning of him), and indeed made it into the credits. Time must have been against them, perhaps. Mayhaps not enough quests made it to Level 3, or he has a specific room he was due to appear in, yet the dungeoneer never made it?
Piecing together the various plans and briefs in David Rowe's book, we may now have some idea as to how Richard's quest would have played out. It seems that Kieran was right: the room behind the Jericho wall is referred to as 'Mogdred's chamber' (or Mordred's, as they apparently called him at first - I guess Spoony wasn't so wrong about that!), and it would have contained an 'M' device like those used to summon Merlin. The name of the room presumably implies that Mogdred would have been summoned instead, perhaps lending support to the theory that the OPPOSITE spell would be needed to transform him into Merlin. That's not quite the end of the quest, though - the final conflict would then have been with the dragon, probably defeating it with a spell from Merlin. Finally Richard would have emerged in the Valley, labelled on the diagram as "FREE!" (Note that the Series 1 quests didn't involve collecting and reassembling any specific quest item.)
Level 3 First Room - The First view of Level 3 for the viewers, nice looking room and and the music was very cool indeed, Loved the Skeleton appearing too, however it looked like the team was never in danger, he stayed still.
I'm not so sure about the lack of danger, as the first two rooms of Level 3 both have 'DEAD' options attached on the diagram! Perhaps they would have died if they tried to walk through the skeleton that was blocking the right-hand door?
I imagine if they walked through the Nilrem door they would of got Merlin berating them for going the wrong way!
The brief for the clue room says "NILREM door choice triggers wipe-out", which seems to imply that instant death would occur if they chose that exit instead of the one marked with the Cup.
Used the SNIFF bottle to 'blind' the sense of smell of the Cavernwites.
Nice detail in the book about the SNIFF bottle containing real perfume.
Merlin Room - He gave them a SHIELD spell but again what on earth was that meant to be used for I wonder???Maybe it was a protection spell from the Medusa room if it appeared in Series 1 to get past???
The Medusa room is indeed included on the quest diagram (after the Gargoyle and before the Jericho wall), and was surely what the SHIELD spell was needed for, but it wasn't shown as they obviously ran out of time. I wonder if that scene was filmed or not?
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Very interesting post Canadanne. Thank you for sharing that information. I'll have to pick up a copy of this book for myself.
Which dragon are you referring to? The one who would go on to become Owen or one we ultimately didn't see? Interesting that the producers would nominate him as the final challenge over a confrontation with Mogdred.
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Which dragon are you referring to? The one who would go on to become Owen or one we ultimately didn't see?
They seem to have gone through several different ideas for the dragon encounter. Tim initially described the dragon lying on a huge raised slab which the dungeoneer would walk past, and it sounds like he was thinking of using a real lizard, as they did with all the toads and spiders etc. Then there were a range of sketches submitted by David Rowe before they settled on the familiar design. So presumably it would have been the same dragon we saw in Series 2, voiced by Lawrence Werber (which was then replaced by Owen as you say).
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Piecing together the various plans and briefs in David Rowe's book, we may now have some idea as to how Richard's quest would have played out ... The name of the room presumably implies that Mogdred would have been summoned instead, perhaps lending support to the theory that the OPPOSITE spell would be needed to transform him into Merlin. That's not quite the end of the quest, though - the final conflict would then have been with the dragon, probably defeating it with a spell from Merlin.
Excellent detective work, Annie.
Unconfirmed information gleaned during the Knightmare Convention weekend suggests that Mogdred may have asked riddles and that the spell from Merlin may have been called REGENERATE. (A happy coincidence since Doctor Who's Seventh Doctor debuted on the same day as Knightmare and was later identified with Merlin.)
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He would have asked them riddles? That would be a very interesting development if true and would tie in nicely with the idea of Mogdred being Merlin's alter-ego, with their behaviour and routines being mostly the same. But whereas failure to answer Merlin's riddles merely results in a lack of help, failure to answer Mogdred would result in an "Ooooh nasty!"
Can anyone tell me whether the alter-ego connection was mentioned in Series 2 or was it confined mostly to Series 1?
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Just Series 1 I think, but happy to be corrected by anyone who's watched Series 2 more closely.
In Series 1, the setup of Mogdred as the anti-Merlin was wasted because no team met Mogdred. In Series 2, it seems he was presented more simply as an evil being to beware of.
By my reckoning, six teams in Series 2 encountered Mogdred and half of those didn't encounter Merlin until afterwards, if at all. As Series 2 watchers, we encountered Mogdred before Merlin (Quest 3), giving no opportunity for the "alter ego" speech we heard from Merlin in Series 1.
I believe the closest Merlin came was in his warning to Team 12: "Mogdred, he glories in the dark side of magic. He can and may hinder your quest..." Ironically, this was (a) the only Series 2 team to encounter Merlin but not Mogdred and (b) was probably already in losing status for not having earned a spell from Merlin.
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Curiouser and curiouser.
That's not quite the end of the quest, though - the final conflict would then have been with the dragon, probably defeating it with a spell from Merlin.
Which kind of makes sense. We don't know what a 'win' sequence from Series 1 would have looked like, but judging from Series 2 (which had its own exit room), I am imagining it would be a simple exit from the Dungeon after the same final room, since there was no real item to collect.
The idea of collecting a quest item during (or just after) the final encounter wasn't really explored until Series 4 - and, even then, there were post-final encounter challenges to overcome (with the exception of Ben from Series 6, who just had to run through some tunnels, and Dunstan, who got a free ride from Hordriss. Possibly also Barry, although his final encounter could have been with Bulstrode. ) So I'm thinking that, if there was a dragon to defeat, then there may have been a room or two afterwards - just to finish the level.
The exit room from Series 2 has the gullotine in it, which I don't think was ever a real threat, but it provides a final 'challenge' for potential winners. This Series may have had the same.
Unconfirmed information gleaned during the Knightmare Convention weekend suggests that Mogdred may have asked riddles and that the spell from Merlin may have been called REGENERATE.
That is quite odd, but not inconceivable. If this is true, then I wonder what REGENERATE would do. It sounds like a spell to restore life force, rather than combative magic to use during a final encounter. I'd assume that the team would pass the dragon by using something like a SLEEP spell (which happened later on in Series 2!), or possibly just leg it (like another Series 2 team when Mogdred woke the beast up!), but I suppose we will never really know!
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I’ve developed a theory concerning Mogdred in Series 1 and how an appearance by him may have panned out. I have based this theory on evidence provided here by Drassil and Canadanne as well as my own observations of the final quest of Series 1.
To begin with, I don’t believe Mogdred would have ultimately proved to be the villain of Series 1, certainly not to the extent he was in Series 2. I see “alter-ego Mogdred” to be a sort of Level 3 counterpart to Lilith. In other words, he is dangerous if displeased but who may ultimately be reasoned with if his demands are met. However, as we are now in Level 3 territory, he will be far harder to placate than Lilith. No mere giving of gifts for Mogdred, oh no!
One thing that struck me about the sole visit to Level 3 in Series 1 was the lack of Mogdred in any sort of physical capacity. No manifestations in front of Richard to taunt and gloat or even to tempt, all of which would become Mogdred traits in the following series. If Mogdred was intended to be a villain at this stage, surely at least one confrontation would have been called for, even if Richard ultimately proved unable to pass though the Walls of Jericho. Another interesting point to note is that, according to David Rowe’s book, the room that lies beyond the Walls of Jericho is called Mogdred’s Chamber. We can deduce from this that the production team most likely did not envisage Mogdred to be an out-and-out villain at this stage, otherwise the room would have been given a more menacing name, such as Mogdred’s Lair, for example. If Drassil’s information is correct and the confrontation with Mogdred would have consisted of riddles, this further cements the idea in my mind that he was conceived as a potential threat and not necessarily a villain.
I haven’t read David Rowe’s book yet, so this next supposition may be easily debunked. It is my belief that alter-ego Mogdred would have looked substantially different than he did in Series 2 and onwards. This alter-ego form would essentially resemble a dark Merlin, with the same long hair, moustache and beard, but clad in black robes and perhaps with flecks of red for extra menace. I imagine he would have sounded more-or-less the same as Series 2 and would have wore a much more malevolent expression on his face, perhaps even the same pale makeup.
With all that in mind, here’s how I envisage Richard’s quest proceeding to victory. Richard picks up the horn instead of the dagger in the clue room and proceeds as normal. Upon reaching the Walls of Jericho, he uses the horn to clear a path. Once all the bricks have vanished, a table with some food and an M device is revealed to the right. After replenishing his Life Force, Richard uses the M device to summon Mogdred, who declares that safe passage can only be gained through the correct answering of three riddles. To answer even one incorrectly would result in him using his dark magic to end the quest. Furthermore, these riddles aren’t exactly straightforward, as befits Level 3. Think of three questions similar to the Avebury and beetle ones of Series 3. All the while, Richard’s Life Force is slowly being drained again thanks to being in close proximity to Mogdred’s dark magic.
Upon all three riddles being answered correctly, Mogdred grudgingly concedes and, having been bested, transforms into Merlin. Merlin congratulates the team and supplies them with a REGENERATE spell, which they immediately cast as Richard’s Life Force is virtually gone. Merlin may also provide them with a very subtle hint about the dragon that lies ahead. The team thanks him and Richard leaves the chamber.
Upon entering the next room, they are confronted by a dragon who is initially extremely hostile and threatens them. This is where the OPPOSITE spell from Mug comes in handy, as it enables the team to calm the dragon and turn him from an enemy into a friend. The dragon then offers help as to how they can escape the dungeon and perhaps opens a previously locked door for them. The team follows his instructions and Richard is able to escape the dungeon, reunite with his advisers and receive his prize.
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What a great ending to series 1.
Team 6 got to level 3 but then threw it away. (I nearly wrote that they blew it, but of course that's exactly what they didn't do, as they took that silly dagger instead of Joshua's fabled horn.) Another team who didn't read the adventurer's code. No weapons unless specifically advised otherwise.
Team 6 did well to a point, but they started to unravel in this last episode. Their directional movement became rather scrappy and they started to really squabble among themselves, when selecting clue objects and during the spear room. It was not surprising that when Treguard told them they should have taken the horn, you could clearly hear one of them say, "Told you!"
Had they taken the horn, they could have got past the wall. Then maybe they might have used the SHIELD spell to get past the medusa (according to the first Knightmare book spells can be used in any level) and the OPPOSITE spell to turn Mogdred's dark magic against him before escaping the dungeon.
I reckon the timing of the quest & episode ending can be accounted for by the two excessively long scenes in level 2, with Cedric/Follly and then with Merlin, which were presumably stretched to fit the quest to the end of the series.
Overall, an enjoyable series, which had planted the seeds of great things to come....
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