Series 4 - Episode 16
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Series 4 has been criticised on this forum for being repetitive, but I agree with the producer who said it's not just new scenes, but what happens in a scene, that makes an adventure (when asked whether our quest featured any new scenes). I think the quality of the character interactions went up in series 4. Bear in mind, too, that we hadn't seen the rest of the series, so the whole thing was completely new to us.
Agreed. Whilst the scenery and landscape in each of the quests during Series 4 may have looked similar, the interactions between dungeoneers and characters throughout the levels were all different in their own unique way.
The actors would have obviously been given a brief description of how the plot outline should work, but how they reacted to that obviously depended on how the dungeoneer and their advisors interacted with the actor at that specific time.
Tim Child himself has described Knightmare as being "commedia dell'arte", meaning that there was no script and the actors have also described their time on the show as being entirely based on improvisation - something I learnt from them whilst making the 25th Anniversary Documentary.
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Thanks for those insights, James.
I once went backpacking in the Amazon and the first time I came face-to-face with one of the waterways (not a busy port like Manaus) it felt similar to KM, but like being in a real (immersive) adventure. A reminder that there are other (and equivalent) adventures - Amazonian spiders and ants won't be for everyone! - to be had even if you weren't fortunate enough to get through the KM shortlisting procedure. Hopefully not reckless ones, though.
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I just spent twenty minutes writing out a replay, pressed a wrong button, and lost all my work. >:D
Tried to put something in italics, screened rolled up, (accidentally) hit the back button, and the very last thing before I was about to save before posting. >:D
I tried to put across that was angry and disappointed the team were cut off when they were. They had made it to level 3, were going along nicely and overcome a number of obstacles and then they cut off to end the series with about three or four rooms to show. Another 15 or 20 minutes they may just have completed the quest, I really thought they were going to do it.
Made a number of references to different rooms encountered and the characters with it. This was one of the best episodes I have seen of the re-runs on Challenge, and they spoilt it significantly with the abrupt ending. In other words, everything up until the last three minutes was good entertainment.
Have to feel sorry for the team that they were denied so late in the quest but the producers made a decision and what's done is done. I don't know if this 'error' was repeated in subsequent series but you could see the disappointment on the teams faces evidently when Treguard called Giles back to be re-united with his team.
Best moments : Ariadne (always a pleasure), Brother Mace, Corridor of Blades, Pickle and his usual 'lively' self.
Worst moments : no need to further elaborate.
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I just spent twenty minutes writing out a replay, pressed a wrong button, and lost all my work. >:D
I hate it when that happens! I've learnt the hard way that it's best to write things in a separate document and then paste them in, rather than typing directly into the browser...
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They really threw everything into the last episode to try and make it exciting.
But not sure if they made to to level 3, there wasn't anything to suggest they had, but then the blades popped up, but then so did the block n tackle which was a level 2 room.
Also under normal circumstances i reckon they would have lost in the COD as he got sliced while crawling in the floor, then all of a sudden his standing and running from side to side. maybe they restarted the room and just carried on until time ran out.
But then the last few minutes sucked, i always liked seeing the dungeons collapse at the end of a series.
I'm shocked they didn't have more winners here, series 4 seems pretty basic.
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Evelyn, glad you enjoyed it!
Wombstar, we did get to Level 3 - as Treguard explained in the programme. The corridor of blades (presumably what you meant by COD) was recorded in one take; it wasn't re-recorded. The production team decided it was an exciting near-miss (otherwise known, perhaps more logically, as a near-hit or a near-slice).
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Ah must have been the way it was edited for the program it looked liked it jumped from one thing to another in the blades, (yeah COB, dunno why i typed Cod, lol)
Yeah wasn't sure if it was level 3 or not, it got a bit jumbled and rooms appeared in an unfamiliar order, Block and tackle after blades then the transporter pad.
As i say they threw everything into the last part so it made for an exciting final episode.
Should have been giving a short cut.. might have just made it in time >
Oh yeah, and this was sadly the final appearance of Merlin and Mog.
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Not sure if they made to to level 3, there wasn't anything to suggest they had
The status board that appeared after their second encounter with Merlin said 'LEVEL 3' on it. Not so much a suggestion as a positive statement.
Brett, out of the 210 Knightmare advisors (including the Geek Week team), I'm more sure than ever that you're my favourite. Your infectious enthusiasm ("Well on our way!"), your team spirit ("Go Giles go!") and your intelligence (noticing that Ariadne sounded like Arachne) helped your quest to rise above Series 4's flaws to become one of Knightmare's most enjoyable. Thank you.
Admittedly, the cast did sometimes steal the scene (Brother Mace). And in the end you were no match for Christmas. But then who is?
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Possibly they repeated part of the COB to make it longer on the programme than it was in filming, wombstar. Scenes were very fluid between Levels on this series, not just on our quest, apart from the signature scenes for each Level.
Another insight about this episode is that we had a fire drill before Giles went into Ariadne's lair, and Motley came out too - mostly in costume, so it was pretty clear what we would have to do! I think we could also see the graphics on our journey back through the studio. The effect whereby Motley appears out of nowhere and pats Giles on the back was filmed afterwards; in reality he entered from the front-right.
Thank you Drassil for your kind words! We tried really hard to move beyond earlier series cliches such as 'You're in a room ...' (inevitable though they doubtless were for the earlier times), to get the movements succinct, to be interesting and to make the show interesting for everyone - ourselves, actors and viewers. I'm glad you enjoyed the episode as much as we did.
If Google were to sponsor a reunion and continuation of our quest ...
Best wishes,
Brett
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Brett, I am still noticing new things about this episode.
As a side effect of Merlin's Christmas conjuring, the items you and the team were holding disappeared: helmet, eyeshield and clipboards. It also put out the candle behind Treguard.
As a side effect of Treguard casting DISMISS, the candle behind him relit.
Truly a magical time.
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Thank you, Drassil; that's very perceptive of you and not something I've been conscious of while watching it post-production. There was at least one rehearsal and at least one take, so I'm not surprised those things disappeared with (floor manager) Tom Hunt's fastidious attention to presentation without our really noticing the overall effect.
Happy New Year!
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Happy Friday 21st December, everyone!
I hadn't realised that: a Friday then, a Friday this year.
I can't help but think of you and your team at this time of year, Brett. Somebody has tweeted the TV listings from 21st December 1990. You were up against Take Two (a programme which had Tim Child as a guest the following year), Behind the Headlines (co-presented by Sandi Toksvig) and the Fifteen to One Grand Final (not presented by Sandi Toksvig).
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Hi Drassil,
Thank you for sharing the tweet with the TV times for Friday 21st December 1990 - interesting to reminisce and amazing to compare it with the schedules of today.
I hope you're having a good Christmas. I thought it was noteworthy this year with the 21st December falling on a Friday.
With best wishes for the New Year,
Brett
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I haven't seen that many of these tv listings for Knightmare since their original publication. I wonder if this is the first one to name the team members in it?
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What an episode, so many points of interest. This could take some time....
Team 8 encountered Brother Mace and earned a "Joker" card. A wonderful moment when Mace mistakenly handed Giles the 3 of hearts instead of the joker. Actor Michael Cule tried to keep a straight face for the remainder of the scene, but his expression made me think that he was desperately hoping for a shout of, "Cut!", which never arrived. He was half-saved by the fact that Mace was clearly supposed to be well-oiled anyway, so any blunder could be explained by that.
An amusing moment at Doorkis, altho not because of the door-monster. The team had forgotten the command and tried several words before they finally remembered the calling, with much relief. You could clearly hear one of the advisors (Robin?) say, "Write that down!"
Passed with 2/3.
On to ariadne's lair and they collected some gold, then played the Joker, so that Motley arrived to distract ariadne.
Used the gold to pay the ferryman for the crossing, then descended the steps to level 3.
In the clue-room they found the key they needed and summoned Merlin, who gifted them the spell "TINY".
The next challenge was the corridor of blades. After a few near-misses, they found their timing and Giles emerged alive. I am convinced that one of the blades (#8) just clipped Giles' right shoulder, but this should only have damaged his life-force anyway. (Rather like Leo being clipped by the axe or Julian stepping in the flames.)
Next was the vale-bridge and Mogdred made his last ever appearance. Giles very firmly refused Mogdred, then hurried across the bridge before it collapsed.
Into the block&tackle room and a memorable performance. As the room began to break up, Giles was given some frantic directions before somehow eventually making it out safely. (Much laughter from Treguard.)
They arrived on the transporter pads but, before they could continue, their quest was cut-off incomplete due to the end of the series.
Unbelievable! Yet again the end-of-series curse struck, but this time it was far, far worse.
In S2 & S3 the final team had been cut-off part-way thru level 2 and it seemed harsh, but to cut-off a team who were on the brink of victory was utterly ludicrous.
Given how much quest-time was wasted in this slow-paced series, particularly with the tortuously slow eye-shield sequences, surely they could have done some editing and created another few minutes screen time for team 8 to complete their quest.
It has been stated that team 8 failed the block&tackle, but were allowed to continue. However, there was little logic in the producers doing this, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway.
(Did this finally produce a change in the approach to series-endings? No, as yet another team were cut-off whilst doing well in S5, but that's for another post....)
Team 8 were extremely unfortunate. They were a very competent team and were one of the most enthusiastic teams ever. (They reminded me of Scott's team in S3 for their general enthusiasm.)
Given how well they did, "DISMISS" seemed rather harsh. "HOME" would have seemed more generous.
The festive ending to the series might have been really nice, but in these circumstances it fell completely flat.
Great sword-play by Samantha Perkins on the closing credits, altho she nearly got a nasty knock on the head when she fumbled it.
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Dear Morghanna,
Thank you for your insightful and sympathetic reflections (it was Andrew who said, "write that down", in fact - and probably not for the first time!).
"It has been stated that team 8 failed the block&tackle, but were allowed to continue. However, there was
little logic in the producers doing this, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway."
The Floor Manager told Giles to take four large steps into the Block and Tackle room; for the first take, he ran in, so he was pretty close to the left-hand exit to begin with. After the floor had given way beneath him, I said, "Er, Giles, could you take a large side step to your right, please?" - there was still some floor on that side of him, you see.
So if there were, indeed, little logic in the production team allowing us to continue, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway (fir tree and wreath delivery notwithstanding!), perhaps the real reason for the second take was a consensus among the production team that the enthusiastic manner of Giles' entry had made the challenge unfair - so we didn't fail it - as hard as it may be to disentangle that motivation from the series ending.
In any event, they allowed us to complete the Transporter Pad room (which we did successfully) and apparently there were four more scenes to go: I venture to suggest that includes the Transporter Pad room itself, plus the final encounter with Mogdred, the Level three weeping door and then the location of our quest object, the Cup that Heals.
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So if there were, indeed, little logic in the production team allowing us to continue, only to cut-off the quest as incomplete in the next room anyway (fir tree and wreath delivery notwithstanding!)
Brett - not sure if you saw this post recently, but it's worth having a look at the Twitch video mentioned within as it looks at your quest referencing what you've mentioned above.
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Thank-you for your input Brett, it is very much appreciated. It's amazing to actually hear from someone who experienced Knightmare in person. It shows how much armchair fans (like myself) miss. That's good that the producers wanted to make the challenge as fair as possible.
From your deduction of what obstacles remained, you were very close to completion.
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