Those that were denied...
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thats a good point,
id just would like to see someone die in the 1st room lol, or in another really stupid situation.
Well, I think we'd all love to see one of those. Just another of those things we'd almost certainly never see though!
On the Gavin argument... well, I'd have liked to have seen the death on the Serpent's Tongue rather than the Quicksand death... was there anyhting regarding clue items they may/may not have had that stopped the Serpent room from just being shifted to later? That way, the team could have worked through a couple of other rooms to be "padded" in before the Serpent room instead...
Though I agree with what the KM staff did - whether they used the footage or not, they may as well use that free time to film a couple more rooms in case they needed them. All the better for lucky Gavin - he got to play a couple of extra rooms!
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Though I agree with what the KM staff did - whether they used the footage or not, they may as well use that free time to film a couple more rooms in case they needed them. All the better for lucky Gavin - he got to play a couple of extra rooms!
I think Gavin probably had a unique 'status' with the production team after being given a reprieve. i think he was probably going to be given the chance to get as far as he could, but with a massive extra degree of harshness - one step out of place and he's dead. The swamp being a perfect example - I think any other team would have been allowed to get away with that, or at least given a hint by Treguard to avoid the swamp.
I think the simple reason for giving Gavin a second chance was because there's no way Broadsword could justify any amount of studio time, actor's time, production staff time, high-technolgy equipment in use etc. without a team being there to be filmed!
Just to throw my hat in the ring on other topics mentioned here.. the main thread running through all points raised (McGrew's DANCE, Mogdred's BUT and Merlin's backward questions) is that there seems to be some inconsistency in the assistance given to the team by Treguard/Pickle.
As has been rightly pointed out, it should have been made immediately obvious to the team that McGrew needed to be shown mercy. As far as they knew he was a dangerous enemy and they simply had to dispose of him - either McGrew should have immediately declared that he'd do anything to help them or Treguard should have drawn their attention to what he was saying.
As for the 'But' spell - a simple hint that they needed to use magic "quickly" would have been enough of a hint. Or at the very least Hordriss should have indicated when 'But' could be used. How were they to know that 'But' needed to be used before 'Transformation'?
The backwards questions was another example of the team clearly not understanding what part they were supposed to play in the challenge before them - admittedly they didn't have a clue what the answer was to the first two questions, backwards or otherwise, so the argument is futile, but I do think they should have been told that they didn't have to give backwards answers themselves.
It's like football referees - all we're asking for is a bit of consistency!
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I think Gavin probably had a unique 'status' with the production team after being given a reprieve. i think he was probably going to be given the chance to get as far as he could, but with a massive extra degree of harshness - one step out of place and he's dead. The swamp being a perfect example - I think any other team would have been allowed to get away with that, or at least given a hint by Treguard to avoid the swamp.
I think the simple reason for giving Gavin a second chance was because there's no way Broadsword could justify any amount of studio time, actor's time, production staff time, high-technolgy equipment in use etc. without a team being there to be filmed!
Yep, I agree. Your second paragraph here is what I've been saying in a rather more long-winded fashion. I do agree on Gavin and Co. too- I guess once they've made a mistake they're unlikely to be given the benefit of the doubt on other occasions. I'm not sure how unique it was, however- there's a few teams who have admitted having died twice, as it were. If we actually heard from all the teams taking part (and they were all completely honest!) I think there'd be a few more too. Being now a cynical old bald wizard- crone composite, I get suspicious on all the occasions when the shot suddenly changes to the advisors when the dungeoneer is marching headlong toward a pit.
I agree on consistency too- although, as I've also said elsewhere, we have to remember the pressures of making a TV show in not enough time, and quick production, originality, excitement and consistency aren't always willing bedfellows.
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I suppose the question I must ask that no one else has is why were the next team not there?. In fact if teams were allowed another 2-3 rooms and each room took an hour to set up then why was the next team 2-3 hours from being there?. Of course if the next team arrived 1 hour after a team had died and been allowed to carry on then they could be kept waiting or even sent home unfairly?.
Hypathetical situtaion
14:00: Team A going well in quest. Team B are 2 hrs from being there ( Whatever that means ). Production staff must now make a decision about bringing in team B as only so much filming can be done in one day. Lets say for arguments sake that filming finishes at 17:00. They decide not to bring in Team B.
14:30: Team A dies, so now they have to be let off.
Now potentialy there is time to film 3 more rooms, what if they die again?. Or do they make the rooms easy?. Maybe some teams died 2 or maybe 3 times. The mind boggles. There are far to many situtations to the questions and if I dont stop now I could go into the meaning of life, paralel universes or what my dreams mean lol.
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the 'but' spell wasn't an un fair death, the team need quick thinking. thats the whole point.
if someone is about to strike u with a fireball u don't spell out a word that u'll never finish in time.. It was the teams stupidity that cost them on that one.
The oppisites rules was explaned.. and again it was up to the team to work them out... but a little help should been offerd.
But what about Un fair left offs? hence todays episode and not being killed by the blocker.. talk about cheat.
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Oh belive me you will get to see some blocker chomping action soon .
In perhaps one of the most hillarious scenarios in KMs history but I won't spoil it for people who havent seen it yet.
but just hold on about 3 more episodes and all will be revealed ;D
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[quote]Sorry to all for butting in here but I got a question for MooCowThingy.
You posted at 3:29 AM!! 'Aint that a hell of a time to be getting hypothetical on us? ! ?
I thought I was bad for insomnia!!
*** 'we now return you to ........"Unfair Deaths" ' ***
Ive been a late nighter since my early teens. Developed some kind of odd addiction to Prisoner cell block H and other very bad late night stuff like Married with children and three's company.
Since then I bought a Dreacast and first became an internet addict on Dreamarena followed by a dreamcast online game addict. A lot of the games I bought were USA only releases so the only times to find people on the game servers was between 12am and 5am.
I love love being up late thats just me Ive been like it for years now. Changes are afoot however as Ive just this minute taken a new job with early starts so I wont be posting here so often or so late anymore . Moneys good though
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we alwaysseem to discuss best teams but some of them only ever include the winning ones what about the ones who did well but met a nasty demise!!!
oh btw people u rpg lot get in rtouch!!! only dave has mailed!!! am still in germany but back sooN!!!
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oh and i forgot to put my fave down!!
Maybe leos team almost made it!! or team with the dungeoneer Sofia -were great for entertainment especially when they back mouthed elita!!!
oh the rason i am posting a lot today because:
A) i am bored and ill and need something to do
+b) i have had no time to visit the site
c) have been wanted to make comments for aged but never got roudn to it!!
he he lol
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In my opinon the best team to not win was Giles in series 4. They really did get pass everything thrown at them getting the block and tackle and corridor of blades in level 3. All they needed was possibly 5 more minutes to complete the transporter pad room, cast tiny and win. They prob would has got another weeping door room though, it seems a shame though as it didnt seem that Dickons quest had as many rooms in level 3.
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Throughout the 8 seasons of KM there were some really good teams that ,if they had of had half as much luck as
some of the teams who defeated the Dungeon, would have won. Here are a list of 6 who can rightly feel aggreived.
(my knowledge of season 5 is bad so i'm sorry for any teams i've missed out).
- Team 3, season2 : Were killed by medusa because they didnt have a shield. In the clueroom they never had any indication as to what to take. Team 4 were the first team to win and they never had to
face medusa.
2)Team 4,season 3 : Killed off at the brink of victory because they answered one riddle wrong.VERY HARSH.
- Team 11, season 3 : Exactly the same as the above team.
4)**Team 8, season 4 ** : Possibly the HARSHEST of all the teams. They were deep into level 3& on the brink of victory. Their quest was ended not because they made a mistake but because the season had ended and they ran out of time.
5)Team 6, season 6 : Died in level 3 because they answered a riddle wrong. The previous team (bens team who had won) never had to answer any riddles in L3.
- Team 2, season 8 : They were killed off at the brink of victory because they didn't have a sight potion.
But in the clueroom the scroll never gave them any clue as to what items they needed to complete the level. They were a genuinely good team. (A bit of anti-semitism on the horizon?)- ONLY JOKING. ANY OPINIONS
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Well, the s8 team weren't unlucky because the sight potions are useless anyway. They just panicked on the CoB, which is the cause of most of the deaths there.
Just because one team doesn't face the same challenges another does, that's not necessarily unfair. So what if team 4 didn't face the medusa? The tools to beat it were provided to team 3 and they chose not to take them. Direct clues are rare in levels 2&3 for EVERY team who gets that far, and in any case common sense should've told them not to take the gem as there's so little human presence on level 3 (at least in the early years) that bribery is a remote possibility. And the old guideline against the weapons of enemies only applies to offensive weapons.
The harshness of S3 is a much-debated point. It does seem awfully linear for every puzzle to be essential for survival, but in the end, if they'd answered the riddles correctly, both teams would have survived. They didn't, so while it's harsh it's still fair as I don't doubt the same rule would have applied to every team in that situation. I would've preferred it if they'd had a tricky but survivable alternative path to victory in the SGW room, but there you go.
Some teams lost because they weren't fast enough, some because of poor guidance, others because they were stupid, others because they were unlucky. ALL of these aspects are common causes of failure in the real world. So the bottom line is, bad luck is part of life.
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