Series 4 Episode 10
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Thats alright. Any time. Thanks for the welcome. I'm starting to blush now! ;D
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Well and there u go.
Great stuff. But kinda silly because the question should have been opposite all the way not just part of the question. Thank god they never did that again.. guess it was just a way to kill off the team.. as they where getting further then should had.
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I don't know what the fuss is over the team anyway. They managed to get the answers completely messed up anyway.
"Who is the daughter of Uther Pendragon?"
opposite
"Who is the son of Uther Pendragon?"
(it could have been who is the mother of Uther Pendragon but no-one would have been able to answer that, and Pickle confirmed it)
Answer: King Arthur
Teams answer: God
Where did that come from? Sorry, barring religious practise God is not the son of anyone, and while he may be the holy Father he was not the holy Mother. So where did God from!?
"What happened to Cinderellas coach at mid-day?"
opposite
"What happened to Cinderellas coach at mid-night?"
Team say "it appeared".
The dungeoneer was right! It did turn back into a pumpkin, but the team were so dumb they never gave it a thought!
"Who should not have been worried about the Ides of March?"
opposite
"Who should have been worried about the Ides of March?"
Answer: Julius Caesar.
Team answer: The March of Ides(???)
There was no reasoning here....the team just didn't know the answer and failed pathetically.
An interesting note is that Merlin described the area as the Chamber of Opposite Extractions. Extraction = Question (i.e. to question somebody is to extract information from them by means of a query). Therefore all the questions were reversed, but the answers were not. The team were meant to give the correct answer (giving a wrong answer would have been far too easy) and the "Falsehood" was the answer to THEIR answer, so therefore was normal and not opposite.
"I'll give you a spell called Sprint"
He didn't. This was the opposite again. As proof the team did not have the spell, the spell book on the status bar opened to reveal...nothing.
Hope that's a bit helpful to anyone who was still puzzled.
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The whole affair goes quite a bit deeper than you realise. A very subtle bit of trickery was employed in this room. It lies not in the riddles themselves, though...
"...if you get the answers wrong then I will be able to reward you with magic!"
If the above sentence spoken by Merlin is reversed then he implies that if they get the answers right they WON'T get magic.
My theory is that not EVERYTHING in the room was reversed - the latter part of the above line, for example. The same applies to when he kept saying "falsehood". They were not reversed, either. Everything else was.
If the team had spotted that small semantic subtlety before the riddles began, I think they would have cottoned on to what was going on. I think they were supposed to answer properly, not reversed. The correct answers can't really be reversed, anyway!
So, a very sneaky bit of trickery. And it worked.
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I wonder what the sprint spell was actually for? I personally had a hunch it was for Ariadne but Treguard said after they died in the block and tackle magic could have saved them. But I think they just took too long there and died but If they had got past the block and tackle then Ariadne would have had them for lunch which would have been lovely .
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No the spell was for the block and takle thing.
After they died they where told magic would have got them past BUT they didn't win any.
Not that they needed magic for that room many people did with out but thats what they where told.
Anway Pikie gave them a big enough clue about the riddle anway.
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Yes, he would give them magic. Everything was opposite. When the girls answered the questions wrong, he said " I give you the magic 'SPRINT'" meaning he won't give them the magic 'SPRINT' get it?
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i still think those questions were pretty hard for kids, (well apart from the Cinderella one) i must admit i didnt have a problem but then, I'm 18 and did Classics at school, I'd have never have got them at 12/13.
The difficulty of the questions seemed to flucctuate quite a lot actually...
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No the spell was for the block and takle thing.
After they died they where told magic would have got them past BUT they didn't win any.
If you forget about what Treguard actually said and think about the rest of the series, it was very linear in nature. The quests themselves didn't have much difference in structure. Merlin appeared at about the same point in each quest in order to provide the teams with an opporunity to earn magic, which in at least two other cases was to escape from Ariadne (the shoe with the RUN spell, and the Hibernate spell that team 3 failed to get which led to their being eaten).
Sprint doesn't make much sense for getting through the block and tackle; it's just as likely to kill you as going too slowly.
So I have two thoughts; either sprint was for Ariadne and the team either needed something else for the B&T or else Treguard was just bluffing (he only said "magic may help you get through it", and "magic could have saved you but I'm afraid you didn't earn it"). If they'd guided Vicky properly they would've been fine, given the B&T was no quicker than for anyone else, and they spent ages just going back and forwards in the middle, shouting conflicting instructions over each other. We're not told which magic might've helped, if any.
The other thought is that Merlin said "I'm going to give you the spell called sprint" (which was, of course, opposite as he did no such thing). Maybe if they'd got it right he'd have said "I'm not going to give you the spell called slow"? Something that brought the b&t to a halt, perhaps.
We'll never know - but quite why this team should've required magical help to get through a standard obstacle I don't know. I still think there was something else. Merlin's opposites was a nice idea for a challenge, but it's just open to far too much interpretation and was wildly out of line with the difficulty of some other quests (Simon was hand-held all the way up to his own stupid death, for example).
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Slightly unusual in the Dungarth entrance, an ogre appeared! Vicki gave him the necklace, then made her escape while he was distracted! I think had they taken the STEALTH potion, they probably would have been able to use it to hide from the ogre (probably invisible, like the invisibility talisman to hide from the troll in Series 2)
Then sidestepped to the right quickly to avoid a giant lizard!
Found Fatilla the Hun guarding the wellway to Level 2. I liked him talking with his mouth full! He had a list of people who were allowed down the well, but he couldn't read so asked Vicki to check if her name was on the list. She lied and said 'yes' =P Also gave him the key, saying it's a magic key which could open any door. I liked them saying 'goodbye' to Fatilla as well!
Knice scene used for Vicki 'falling' down the well. Entered an unusual room with a waterfall and a pit in the middle, not used much in KM. Vicky VERY nearly fell down into the pit of water! Perhaps she did but got let off?
Encountered Gundrada who thought Vicki was a dwarf, and was about to chop her head off! After a bit of convincing, Gundrada guided Vicki out of the room and came along.
In the next room, they were faced with a bit of a dilemma! Mellisandre was in the stocks. Either they could free Mellisandre and go with her, or carry on with Gundrada and her sword. They decided to free Mellisandre, and Gundrada walked off in a huff
Mellisandre guided them through the next couple of rooms, after requesting that Vicki help her look out for that mad barbarian (Fatilla). Look out for the lightning conductor in the eye-shield sequence - probably didn't have them in medieval times
In another room they found Merlin writing at a desk. Merlin said everything opposite, including the riddles he didn't set! They got all the riddles wrong, as they didn't grasp the idea of the backwards riddles - they thought they had to give their answers backwards as well! They also thought that 'falsehood' meant they got it right!
Merlin appeared to give them a SPRINT spell, but they didn't in fact get it (look at the spellbook on the status bar, it's empty) since they got the riddles wrong.
Then hit by a lower flying block in the Block and Tackle, and died. The SPRINT spell could have saved them, but they didn't earn it!
Next challenger is Dickon Hairs (or Hess). I wonder if they'll keep in the 'Dickon got the horn' line this time? =P
Chose the crown route on the Spindizzy place of choice. The crown symbol was obscured by that 'Game Show Gods' thing that Challenge put on the screen though
They got to the area with Dooris, the drawbridge/door monster. The mouth didn't seem to be aligned properly, it was too high! Pickle gave them the calling, and the question and answer session started. The voice was the higher 'female' voice.
Scored 3/3 on the True and False questions, and gained passage. But timed out as soon as the drawbridge opened!
Knice modified-color boat ride footage used under the credits.
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Missed the first five mins of this ep
This team choose to free Mellisandre from the stocks instead of staying with Gundrana, although Mellie didn’t actually directly help them (this is unfortunately becoming a bit of a habit)
Then had a bit of a tough set of riddles in that they were unsure whether to give the answers or their opposites (they got the jist of question 2 although they had no idea about the other 2)
The team didn’t receive the magic – it wasn’t written in the spell book (I guess Merlin was still speaking in opposites.
Although it is now difficult to spot losing status (although missing the spell would secure it) but this team have been heading for disaster.
And enter Dickon…
Picked the crown and met Dooris where they scored 3 out of 3.
Rather nice landscape showing a moat to finish.
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I think Vicki's 3 advisors didnt guide vicki well especally in level 2. Ok I got myself mixed up with Merlins questions. Its all went coo coo up in my head. But back to the guideing. Even if Vicki didnt have the Sprint spell, it properly woudnt matter cos it takes good guideing to get Vicki through the B&T like a peace of cake.
I wonder if the Sprint spell was for Areatnie the Spider, cant spell her name so correct me if am wrong.
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Easily the most confusing scene in Km, Merlin's opposites riddles. I knew a couple of the answers, but really, it's headache time.
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Specific episode discussion only! Please find the right thread.
A thread already exists: http://www.talkknightmare.co.uk/yabbse/http://www.knightmare.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=6;action=display;threadid=439
I think Merlin confused everyone, even I had trouble in understanding what he said.
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First things first. Spent about 10 minutes worrying as to wether or not I'd see this ep due to storm interfearence.
Started of with a cameo from Jeremy Beadle. Then into the wellway room for another cameo from a young John Prescott!Met Gundrada in the next room. For some reason the poor girl started to walk forwards. Maybe she was folowing Gundrada's voice? Anyway, walking straight towards the pool....
PANIC!!! WAAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!
Ahem. Moving swiftly on. Met Melly. Freed her from the stocks causing Gundrada to storm off. ( No pun intended)Opposites chamber next. Team got very, very, very confused. I believe the answers were...
Arthur
Turned into a pumpkin
Julius Caeser
If I'm wrong, and I probably am, then may Ritz strike me down. Block and tackle + failed riddles = death.
Dickon next, and I think we probably will be treated to Pickles outrageously suggestive coment of "Dickon's gotthe horn, master", but the isn't Pickle just one big walking innuendo when it all comes down to it? Think about that one before you answer.
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I still belive the SPRINT spell was for ariadne
And that they could have done the block and tackle just like other teams had before but they panicked so ...... heh.
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Allow me to punch the air with a joyful "Yeeeeeesss!" as I now have all of Series 4 on tape, just in time. Remember when I said episode 8 was weird? Well, it isn't a patch on this.
"Aah, don't they look sweet and helpless?" says Treguard, referring to Vicki & Co. WHAT?! Who are you, and what have you done with the real Treguard? Maybe he just had too much bubble bath today and is feeling all cutesy, or something.
Ah-ha, that's why! Fireguard, Treguard's evil twin (better known as the Ogre) is prowling round the dungeon. He growls a bit before Vicki gives him the bracelet she's carrying, which he seems to like so clears off. The panic continues when they hurriedly tell Vicki to run past the Giant Lizard, and then onto Fatilla, who's also in a very odd mood today - he appears to have got a job as the Level 1 Bouncer, stating that Vicki can't go in the well unless she's on The List. Except he can't read it, so asks her if she's on it..."Say yes, Vicki" the team say, immediately. Heck knows who else was on there, in the four years of KM so far we've never seen anyone other than dungeoneers who have been down there. Anyway, Fatilla asks for a tip, and Vicki picks him up and throws him off screen...nah, she gives him a key, which she says is a magic key that can open every door. Why, it must be the son of Casper!
The team enter Level 2 in the weirdest way ever - you see the sky getting further away as we go down the well, then a mid shot of Vicki floating down in mid-air to Gundrada's Glen, which is just too good (/subtle joke). Gundrada's also been affected by Merlin's Madness, as she thinks Vicki's a dwarf (with a helmet on?!) and goes to chop her head off. The team panic, and almost, almost plunge Vicki in the gaping pit in the middle..."STOP!!" they all scream in unison, probably the biggest on the decibel scale until Rebecca and Co tackle the runes in Series 8, which actually broke the glass on my TV ("This is, of course, a complete lie"). They eventually convince her, and Gundrada tries this advising lark for herself, guiding Vicki into a safer place and then manoeuvring her out the room.
Oh, go away Melly. The 'barbarian's' coming to get you, is he? Even though we've just seen him happy with his job as a bouncer? And, yes, you want out that Thing That Constrains People? We fell for this before, and all you did was steal one of the dungeoneer's items and run off. The team are given a choice - stick with Gundrada, or help out Mellisandre? They fall for Melly's scheme, so Gundrada storms out in a huff, probably thinking "I can't work with these amateurs!". And Melly...goes with them to the next room and clears off again. Yeah, good move team. Although she does help them out the room, repeating the 'I'm not getting any older' stuff from last time. What sounds like Treguard chuckles halfway through.
Everyone is messed up in this episode. But it is by far Merlin who is mostly affected, after all it's him where Merlin's Madness comes from. Last time we saw him he'd lapsed into sanity and asked the dungeoneer a straightforward riddle, ala the old days. Whereas now, HE'S GONE TOTALLY ROUND THE BEND MENTAL. "Don't sit down" he says, "I'm not the guardian". No, you're not The Telegraph either. This is also "not the Chamber of Opposite Extraction". Nurse, nurse!! The team stare in silence, and he gives them riddles. Pickle hints that you have to answer the opposite of what the real answers are, to humour him. I swear I heard Tim Child say "John, what the hell are you doing? Stick to the script!" at one point.
The first riddle they get wrong. Then the second. "Falsehood" says Merlin on both counts..."Does that mean we're right?" says one of the advisors. They're confused. I'm confused. Probably so is John Woodnutt, and quite a few of the five million watchers. His final riddle asks who didn't have to worry about the Ides of March, and the team, completely given up by now, say the March of Ides. "What?" says the dungeoneer, now also baffled. Falsehood again, so Merlin gives them a spell, SPRINT. So has he given them a SLOW spell, or what? The status bar shows no spell at all. What in god's name is going on?
They die in the next room, the Block and Tackle again. Except it seems they could have easily done it without whatever spell they had or didn't have, they just messed the directions up and had Vicki faff about on the spot for a bit. They're hit by a block and the breaks up, with real life -cracking sounds (and to think, fifteen years later the BBC removed a similar sound effect from primetime Saturday Night Doctor Who). The team stare at each other, then at Treguard, and are DISMISSED. "Strange, because its not the opposition that confused you, merely the opposites". Shove off, Treg.
The next team's dungeoneer is a chap called Dickon. "Pardon?" ponders Pickle. "Dickon" says Treguard. What is this, Carry On Knightmare? They choose the crown quest, and face the obligatory Bore Monster (who's mouth seems to have been composited in wrong today, it's oddly green tinged. Maybe she's just ate something that disagreed with her) and we time out. Treguard scary as hell as he asks us whether he thinks it's a game. Of course it is.
Isn't it?
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