knightmare on youtube
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I'm quite annoyed because, as you said above, they are not officially availible and it was the only way to watch them. I should have download them from youtube because I knew they would be removed eventually, but I never did.
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The problem, as I understand it, is that as long as the episodes are available elsewhere, other people are reluctant to buy the rights.
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Well, we tried that path, but there wasn't enough interest and therefore no way to make back the money it would cost.
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Unfortunately, now that Challenge have bought the rights it is too late. We'll likely need to wait another 5 years now.
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My perspective on the episode uploads on YouTube was always 'enjoy it while it lasts'. I'd never have guessed that their eventual removal would be prompted by an official new Knightmare episode from YouTube itself! Legal or not, their removal is a loss to the fandom (especially since the comments have yielded behind the scenes nuggets not found elsewhere) and will quite possibly lead to an increase in pirate DVD sales.
I still feel that in an ideal world, Knightmare belongs on TV. So I hope that Challenge will try to get the rights to show Series 3-8.
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My perspective on the episode uploads on YouTube was always 'enjoy it while it lasts'. I'd never have guessed that their eventual removal would be prompted by an official new Knightmare episode from YouTube itself! Legal or not, their removal is a loss to the fandom (especially since the comments have yielded behind the scenes nuggets not found elsewhere) and will quite possibly lead to an increase in pirate DVD sales.
I still feel that in an ideal world, Knightmare belongs on TV. So I hope that Challenge will try to get the rights to show Series 3-8.
The problem with YouTube is it's a double-edged sword. There's no point bringing up legalities here, but while the point you raised concerning the possible increased trade in illegal DVDs is a valid one, but the YouTube episodes have (at least in my experience of the site) potentially made the whole situation far worse.
YouTube is supposed to be a secure video publishing/viewing site. In practice its security is full of holes. Pretty much the whole internet knows this - if a video has been on the site chances are at least somebody has physically downloaded it as well. If the video is an entire episode of a TV program, a music video or a movie people are far quicker to download the file because they hope to do so before the video is pulled for copyright reasons.
When you have the entire history of Knightmare available for a long period in a format which any Joe Public with a basic computer and internet access can download locally, in an unencrypted format, free from DRM, under their full control - you have a major problem. There's no way of knowing who has the files, how many copies are out there or what people could be planning to do with them. Whatever the situation might have been with the illegal DVD sales a while back, the damage could spread much further much faster now. We can only hope this doesn't come to pass.
I do agree in principal that it would serve the greater good for those classic episodes to be viewable somewhere someplace. The only real caveat is that it should be somewhere that's much more invested in security and certain precautions are in place.
I wonder if Tim has ever considered the possibility of making episodes available electronically through services such as ITunes? Services like that are reasonably secure, the files are digitally signed (and can only be played on the devices to which they are downloaded, meaning they can't be resold or passed around), and I'm sure people wouldn't mind paying a small fee. This sort of thing has got to be far safer than an admittedly risky DVD venture in any case.
If people can obtain episodes relatively inexpensively, that would surely drive away the pirate market since people would have legal channels to use and be taking far less risk with their purchases.
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Some perspective on the recording and posting of whole Knightmare episodes on YouTube. I imagine some of you on this site may well have done this without necessarily thinking things through.
Firstly its illegal. Completely illegal. It’s also illegal to post Knightmare clips, but as the primary intellectual rights holder, I have always regarded the posting of clips as ‘promotional’ to the format and its ‘made programmes’, and therefore turned a blind eye. I’m also well aware that its done with affection and in homage to the concept. I think my colleagues at ITV feel the same. I know that most of the long term Knightmare cast concur
So what’s different about the result of recording and posting whole programmes?
Well by doing so you rob the entire cast, not just by the revenues they should have received by an act of piracy, but also you damage and devalue the programmes that were copied, making networks like Challenge less willing to shell out for them, and pay the cast, writing and music residuals. Furthermore you make it even less likely that a new broadcast undertaking would consider the heavy investment in format needed to bring about a fresh version of Knightmare. No-one likes to compete with freebies.
So in summary: if you record and post whole programmes, you stiff the cast, you stiff the composer, you stiff me, and if you’re one who counts themselves part of any bring-back-knightmare campaign, you stiff yourself.
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So... does that mean there will be an official DVD box set somewhere on the distant horizon?
I would absolutely LOVE a Ltd Edition Box set with behind-the-scenes stuff as extras, maybe the 25th Anniversary videos, and the GeekWeek episode as an Easter Egg (I've been quite consistent in that despite the peeking on youtube - my main aim is for an official box set)
Heck, I wouldn't buy it just for me, it would be the must-have Xmas 2013 present of choice amongst most of my friends!
I just realised that it would be a great alternative for people who could not make it to the proposed convention
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I believe it won't be straight forward to do a dvd boxset but if there ever is a time for this to come to life, it's now. While there is a huge buzz around Knightmare, there is no better time to do this. Otherwise it will never happen. I for one would buy it, regardless of the cost.
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Stick to topic please.
The topic is "knightmare on YouTube".
By all means, create new threads in relation to books and DVD releases.
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How many children's game shows have actually made it to DVD though?
I am sure you don’t need me to tell you that the DVD market is not what it once was due to the rise of on demand/streaming/download services.
Aside from Challenge TV repeats, I'd say an iTunes release would be the most likely thing to hope for now.
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I understand the points about YouTube, online piracy, and the entire debate that's going on these days regarding material development and if money should be going to the right people etc. But in terms of Knightmare specifically, is there no common ground between having Knightmare available or nothing?
I mean if by watching episodes of Knightmare repeatedly for the last year on YouTube I apologise if that is stiffing you, and everyone, but is that something that can be avoided in this day and age? Would it have made a difference if I didn't click on the videos and watched them? Is not watching Knightmare the best thing to do for the series. Its so confusing as a fan when you don't have access to what your a fan of.
I also understand DVDs are out of the question. In fairness, why would anyone apart from avid fans and collectors buy an DVD box set outside of the Christmas period. Its not a good move, especially when you see a huge work of art which a Knightmare box set would be, going for £15 in a HMV bargain basket, when it cost more to make the damn discs and packaging.
What I am getting at, if Knightmare has been removed due to legal reasons, then that's fine and as it should be. It is fair and just, but then will we see some fair and just for us fans who want to see it, and are actually willing to pay money to do so? We are not given that option is the point I am trying to drive home. I mean here's my money! Take it! Get it on a paid for service site, like iTunes or Netflix so the fans can give back to you guys what we feel you are entitled to.
I know it must be sinkeningly unfair to see your works available for free, but there must be a common ground here for us fans who now don't have access to watch the show that has resulted in the fans we are today. There has to be
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